Facebook photos

Not sure if this is the right place to ask this, but here goes…
I take pictures (for fun) of my sons sports teams and post them in private Facebook groups I create. Parents have posted these pictures on their own page, and I have no problem with this. I like taking pictures and feel overall the other parents appreciate it.
Yesterday my son brought home his high school yearbook and I saw that pictures I took were in it. I “joked” about it in the Facebook group saying basically how surprised I was and added if they were goi g to use my photos they could have used one of my son (with added laughing emoji) A parent responded and said that a high school senior reached out to her and she gave her access. Also she added that she didn’t know or have control over what photos were used. An hour or so later the mother of the high schooler messaged me and said she saw what I wrote (daughter must have shared with her or parent that added her to Facebook group) and said how it is hard work and rhey are busy and can’t go to every activity and “have to seek out photos” also said they try to include a variety of kids in the pictures and ended with saying my kids should join yearbook. I do not know how I feel about all this, if I would have been asked I would have said yes, and probably would have said I would send her some (she did not pick the clearest photos I took) I feel like reaching out to the yearbook advisor out of principal as kids should not just be taking pictures off of Facebook. Or it’s not a big deal and forgot about it. I would think part of yearbook is taking photos. It was when I was younger. What do people think? How are yearbooks done at your child’s school? Thanks

Username wrote: kids should not just be taking pictures off of Facebook

Who’s gonna stop them… the internet police. lol
Once an image leaves your computer, you have Zero control of it, watermark or no watermark.

Out of principle… Man, this is 2023
ethics "went down the Swanee" many years ago.

Regarding Facebook, they can do anything with your images, including make a profit which will not be shared with you.

I am afraid this is absolutely true, which why I refuse to go near Facebook.

See here.

David

In this instance, I believe kids should not take photos off Facebook. They signed up to work on the yearbook, not sure if it is a class or an activity. But I think the school should have higher standards and teach the kids the “right way”
I do believe the great majority of people have ethics. Perhaps I hold people and especially educators to a higher standard. If you are going to do a project, do it the right way and don’t cut corners.
I guess I’m learning…like I said parents have used my photos in the past. But this just felt different
Oh well

It costs nothing to ask permission, but people have got used to thinking that everything on the internet is free and they can do what they like with anything they come across on the WWW. The "sharing economy" is more like the "thieving economy" at times

This run parallel to the fact photographs have little no commercial value. I have had people ask me to use pictures on my blog for free, and I had a thief, who stole a whole series of low resolution files, to illustrate a book. When I complained, the publisher helpfully told me that they did not pay for the use of photographs in their book.

nyccounsel.com/who-owns-photos-and-videos-posted-on-facebook-or-twitter/

Excerpt:

"Under Facebook’s current terms (which can change at anytime), by posting your pictures and videos you grant Facebook “a non-exclusive, transferable, sub-licensable, royalty-free, worldwide license to use any [IP] content that you post on or in connection with Facebook (“IP License”). This IP License ends when you delete your IP content or your account unless your content has been shared with others and they have not deleted it. Beware of the words “transferable, sub-licensable, royalty-free, worldwide license.” This means that Facebook can license your content to others for free without obtaining any other approval from you! You should be aware that once your photos or videos are shared on Facebook it could be impossible to delete them from Facebook, even if you delete the content or cancel your account (the content still remains on Facebook servers and they can keep backups)! So, although you may be able to withdraw your consent to the use of photos on Facebook, you should also keep in mind that if you share your photos and videos with Facebook applications, those applications may have their own terms and conditions regarding how they use your creation! You should read the fine print to make sure you are not agreeing to something that you don’t want to have happen."

In other words, what they did was perfectly legal per Facebook's terms and conditions.

If it were me, I would reach out to the yearbook advisor rather than the principal -- explain the situation and be clear that you are completely okay with them using the images (assuming you are) this time, but also that this might be a good idea to do some teaching around what is and is not appropriate in this sort of situation. Especially in what is essentially a journalism context. If the layout people have to do a little extra work to make room for a photo credit for you, that might be a reasonable way to emphasize the point. :)

This is the route I am thinking of doing. I am fine with using photos I took. I made the Facebook page for parents, and have even taken extra pictures of some kids when their parents said they were using them to make a Shutterfly book. As this was a school class or club the students should be (preferably) taking photos or at least acquiring them respectfully

If it were me, I would do nuthin’.
You don’t want to look like a busybody, now do you.

Hey, teacher, leave them kids alone. lol

I was on yearbook staff back in the 1970s in the days when we actually pasted printed photos and text on blueline layout sheets. My high school was lucky enough to have a photography lab led by a teacher and staffed with student photographers so all our activity photos came from them.

Nowadays, yearbooks are created much like photobooks by uploading photos and text into templates. Anybody can do it now. Here's an example from Entourage Yearbooks.

I had a hard time following your post. Did the parents put this yearbook together as an independent volunteer activity? I wouldn't expect a typical parent to know much about the ethics of sharing photos or copyright issues.

Is there a teacher assigned as a yearbook advisor at the school? Of all people, the teacher/advisor should be aware (or made aware) of the basics and ethics of using copyrighted material. You might decide to just let this go, but some other future unaware photo contributor could raise a big stink. They need to know this. The schools in my city go as far as handing out media release forms to be signed by parents at the beginning of the school year (example, PDF format).

The T&Cs of Entourage Yearbooks puts the responsibility of handling copyrighted material entirely on the user:

"5. YOUR WARRANTY
You warrant, represent and agree that you will not contribute any User Submissions or otherwise use the System in a manner that (i) infringes or violates the intellectual property rights or proprietary rights, rights of publicity or privacy, or other rights of any third party; (ii) violates any law, statute, ordinance or regulation;... plus lots of other stuff.

I did not understand parts of your scenario (especially, do not understand how the yearbook is created) but I get your overall point and question.

My first thought was that once you put something online without a warning or copyright, all bets are off. I think FB policy quoted by @Mackiesback confirms that in a way. It's not whether I agree with FB (I am not on FB for many reasons and removed WhatsApp from my phone when FB acquired the company), but that's how online stuff works AFAIK.

All organizations like product/service providers publish their policy and client's responsibility. If the publication of Yearbook is in anyway connected with the school, then the school must make their rules very clear that students should not gather any photos without explicit permission from the owner. Here, the mistake may be on their part.

There is nothing disrespectful or unethical about how they acquired these images. You, in effect, threw these images out there in the social media equivalent of creative commons. The FB terms and conditions, which you approved when you signed on, have pretty much spelled out for you that they pretty much own these images now. I am not sure what you are looking for at this point. Recognition? Acknowledgment?

If you had sent these to them in an email, entirely different story. But that's not what you did. And yes, anybody or team producing a HS yearbook should have someone with a basic understanding of copyright in the room. Too many in the social media generation do not.

I had to look on the school website as I wasn’t sure. It appears “yearbook” is a class for credit that’s meets after school at least once per week. Also application to take the class states you should be available to take pictures at events/games.

Recognition? No acknowledgment? No
The situation just seemed odd. I guess I had higher expectations for the yearbook staff. Oh well.

I shoot a lot of photos at my city's nature preserve. Many times I submit them to the manager and they wind up published in city documents and websites. The city's rules for photographing children are so darned strict and pervasive I get this feeling they had a "big stink" problem in the past.

Important film to watch if you have not already seen:
www.thesocialdilemma.com/
Avoid Facebook at all costs! Humanity’s greatest existential threat...

Per the below screenshot, Facebook members may not do anything "That infringes or violates someone else's rights, including their intellectual property rights (such as by infringing another's copyright or trademark, or distributing or selling counterfeit or pirated goods), unless an exception or limitation applies under applicable law."

The photos are the copyrighted property of the OP. They were taken and published without his consent. My advice would be to reach out to the school's principal to express your disappointment at how this has been handled. At the very least, an apology is in order. A good principal will find a creative way to publicly recognize the photography as your work and to thank you for your support of the school. They will also find a way to make this into a teachable moment on the importance of respecting the rights of artists and content creators.

Good luck.

You don’t have to be a Facebook member to view and download photos.

If either of my parents approached my school with a complaint like this I would be absolutely mortified...😲
‘Hey’… ‘Jimmy’s dad (the old fart) was in the headmaster’s office complaining about some crappy photos.’

The OP’s kid has to survive the rules of the schoolyard for the rest of his days at this school.
Have you forgotten how evil kids are?

I don't recall that any of the photos in my 1972 yearbook were given attribution.

I've taken shots of my grandkids sporting events and made them available temporarily to the other parents - you basically put them out there for anyone to take.

Should somebody have asked? Probably.

Is whining about it going to help anything? Probably not. It's possible that next year's yearbook will have a totally different advisor.

I like the idea.
I am not very hopeful, but I support it.