• Members 140 posts
    April 26, 2023, 12:14 p.m.

    I’m surprised that the “camera pundits” have ignored the obvious: Canon has completely ignored one of the biggest advantages of mirrorless technology: Exposure Preview!

    Exposure Simulation does not show you where your shots will be blown out and neither does a Histogram. With Canon mirrorless cameras, if you want to know where your photos are overexposed, you need to take the shot and look at it, same as a DSLR.

    Even more maddening: The feature (zebra stripes) is available if you’re shooting videos, but not in stills mode. Why is that?

    Could you help me? Please send an email to cpsmember@cits.canon.com, and ask them to add the zebra stripe option to Stills shooting? Hopefully, if they get enough requests, they’ll eventually do it. And I could really use the help. Thanks!

  • Members 174 posts
    April 27, 2023, 12:04 p.m.

    even then those highlight warnings don't tell your where it's actually overexposed, if you target raw processing.

  • Members 140 posts
    April 27, 2023, 1:38 p.m.

    True, but it will do just fine. If I “close the donut hole” enough on an overexposed area, leaving just a little blinking, the RAW headroom will fill in the gap. I’m fine with that.

    My experience disagrees with logic on this point: “They” say that as long as you don’t saturate the sensor, you’ve captured the full tonal range of the subject. This is not true in my experience. What I observe is that if you’re shooting something like, say, a wedding dress, it’s not good enough to ETTR to just under the threshold, because in that too 8 to 10% brightest zone, image quality and detail gets lost. You can try this yourself, or maybe you have. Not saying ETTR is wrong, just that if you have something very light in your photo and you want its detail to come out, don’t expose it to just under saturation. You need to darken a little bit more.

    PS - Please email cpsmember@cits.canon.com and ask them to add zebra stripes for still images to Canon mirrorless cameras, just as they have for video.

  • Members 1 post
    May 31, 2023, 8:29 a.m.

    It's a decent simulation for the current generation cameras.
    I'd rather not have a more accurate exposure simulation at the cost of speed or battery life.

    Also, zebra stripes won't really help with this, it (and the histogram) uses the estimate from the same source.

  • May 31, 2023, 12:45 p.m.

    Strictly, both misnomers.

  • Members 83 posts
    June 1, 2023, 5:53 p.m.

    Explain for those who might not have read all of your other posts?

    Statements like that do not seem helpful to me without context. It is more like name-calling without criticizing a specific behavior and giving reasons why the behavior is bad. If we could assume that all had read your posts in other threads, then there might be no need for explanation.

    Thanks in advance for providing an explanation.

  • Members 534 posts
    June 1, 2023, 6:04 p.m.

    "Exposure", unqualified, should refer to absolute exposure. The "Exposure Simulation" in a camera, is not simulation of absolute exposure, but the lightness that results with relative exposure, for a given ISO setting.

  • Members 83 posts
    June 1, 2023, 8:25 p.m.

    Does ISO 12232:2019 standard get it wrong?

    What Canon says about "Exposure Simulation" in the manual:

  • June 1, 2023, 8:43 p.m.

    The simulation is of how dark or light the final processed image will look.
    'Exposure' does not mean how dark or light the final processed image will look.

  • Members 83 posts
    June 1, 2023, 8:45 p.m.

    Is that not what the standard says a digital camera must do? Did Canon misunderstand the standard?

  • June 1, 2023, 8:51 p.m.

    I'm not sure what 'absolute' and 'relative' means in this context. Does it mean integrated (over the whole frame) as opposed to local (at a point).

    No it doesn't get it wrong. What does it say that you interpret as being in conflict with what is being simulated being lightness.

    Canon (or at least the person who wrote that for Canon) on the other hand does get it wrong. The key mistake is 'the actual brightness (exposure)'. 'Exposure' does not mean 'the actual brightness', and 'lightness' is a much better word in this context. 'Brightness' sounds like an amount of light, and that train of thought leads to the whole confusion between exposure and how light or dark the image looks.

  • June 1, 2023, 8:56 p.m.

    What is it you're thinking that a digital camera must be doing? I can't make sense of what you wrote there (not a criticism, we all say things that don't make sense sometimes)

    I don't think that the bit you quoted can be taken as indicative of Canon's corporate opinion. I'm sure their engineer who is on the ISO committee (he's the chair, as I remember) understands it well. But the technical author who wrote that made at least one major mistake.

  • Members 83 posts
    June 1, 2023, 8:57 p.m.

    So Canon should have said "actual brightness"instead of "actual brightness (exposure)".

    How does this help a photographer reading a Canon manual? What does the ISO standard require Canon to report for an "ISO" camera setting? Does Canon fail to meet the standard?

  • Members 83 posts
    June 1, 2023, 8:59 p.m.

    Thanks for your helpful explanations.

  • June 1, 2023, 9:06 p.m.

    The person who wrote that for Canon would have been better to use the word 'lightness', rather than 'brightness' and certainly shouldn't have confused it with exposure.
    So far as the ISO standard goes, it defines the most used version of ISO, (SOS) as follows:
    Screen Shot 2023-06-01 at 22.07.36.png
    So, what it defines ISO as is a specification of 'value' against 'exposure'. 'Value' is another term for 'lightness', but a less descriptive one, which is why I prefer to use 'lightness'. It is the note that makes this clear, as it relates the 'level' to an sRGB 'value'.
    Anyhow, what the VF or LCD is showing is not the exposure, but the value or lightness which results from that exposure at the given ISO setting, according to the present processing defaults in the camera.

    That's a question for Canon's technical author, as to why the manual includes errors.

    The cameras meet the standard, so far as I know. The manual is confused.

    Screen Shot 2023-06-01 at 22.07.36.png

    PNG, 59.2 KB, uploaded by bobn2 on June 1, 2023.

  • Members 83 posts
    June 1, 2023, 9:18 p.m.

    Are the camera menus in error as well? The menu calls it "Expo. simulation".

  • June 1, 2023, 9:23 p.m.

    As I said, it's a misnomer. What is being simulated isn't exposure. As an aside, I'm not sure what you think it is that the standard says. What it certainly doesn't say is that lightness and exposure are the same thing. In fact if they were the standard would be completely self-contradictory.

  • Members 83 posts
    June 1, 2023, 9:29 p.m.

    I do not have free access to the entire standard. Does the standard use the word "lightness"?