Have Phones Killed The Genuinely Compact Camera Market ?

If it's under 300mm I use my phone camera. Many years ago it was a point and shoot or a bridge camera. Now it's a phone.

Danny.

Phone cameras are impressive these days. I made an A3 sized print on my Epson P900 from my £150 Motorola phone. It looked indistinguishable from a full frame camera print. Amazing.

And phones are so convenient, you carry one everywhere.

But... they are horrible to use as cameras. No grip, slippery bars of soap, no viewfinder, just the screen which I'm too old to see without glasses. No physical controls. Taking pictures on a phone with the faux leather diary style cover I use is even more awkward because the front cover is flapping in wind. And it's a pain switching it on, unlocking it, loading the camera app and all that palaver. From an ergonomic and usability perspective, phones are the pits. I'm glad my phone has a camera and even happier I rarely have to use it.

I think the camera manufacturers did little to provide a viable compact camera alternative for enthusiasts. There were many attempts, but so many of them were badly compromised by sluggish performance, poor viewfinders, tiny controls and so on. The Sony RX100 series is neat but nearly as awkward to use as a phone. The top end compacts from Nikon and Canon have historically been fettered by weak performance. Looking at reviews, the Nikon P7800 looks almost like it is a top end compact suitable for substituting for a bigger camera when you need to travel camera bagless. But instead of building a truly state of the art camera, it is hobbled by weak processing speeds. Daft! I end up carrying a EM10 or Gx7 with the collapsible kit lens. Not ideal but the high end compacts were never all round good enough. I can see why people would give up on them and use their phone. As for the budget compact cameras, yuk!

Oh, and before I forget, motorised lens mechanisms. Just why? The crappy selotape mechanical zoom on my 12-32mm kit lens is so superior.

@DavidMillier

No slippery bars of soap for me.

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I am not suggesting you change your behavior or preference but…

Several of your complaints about using a phone as a compact camera could be addressed by one interested and willing to do so.

No help for the viewfinder. However, my first Lumix compact camera didn't have one either. That screen was so dim I had to attach a Hoodman to see it — at least I can usually get by shielding my iPhone screen with my hand.

My phone has a physical shutter control in the form of a volume switch. Adjustments beyond that can be a bit fiddly — just as I found them to be on the compact cameras I used in the past. I've mastered the two-three things I do commonly — just as I did the menu systems of those cameras.

I deliberately choose a case that provides a good grip, not a flappy faux leather folio. I use a US$20ish Smartish Gripzilla, with a Peak Design anchor threaded through the lanyard hole — allowing me to attach a wrist strap for photowalks. I also have an inexpensive grip, with a removable remote shutter button for dedicated photowalk/travel purposes — it stays home most of the time though.

The phone itself wakes up automatically as I raise it — no need to power it on — and a quick press of a lock screen widget, or swipe on the screen itself, activates the camera. In practice, it's every bit as quick to deploy as any of my dedicated cameras.

Again, I'm not insisting you should use, or enjoy, a phone camera. I'm trying to dispel the myths around phone photography and encourage others to give it a try. I have a foot in both camps and enjoy making photographs with the tools I have available.

None of this pertains to the OP’s question about the market as a whole. One look at the camera mobile device department at my local big box warehouse tells me that the ship has sailed.

I have an older iPhone, and use the 3.5mm jack EarPods as a shutter release cable.

I don't think it's quite that simple. Arguably that segment has been propped up by large numbers of people we would not consider to be photographers. When they stray to phones, the manufacturers no longer make the gear. I am not sure how those of us that like a good compact can really prevent that. Our numbers are too low.

Replied to a quote...will re-reply with the quote

Or they hire free-lancers....I know many people who take photo's for High School Sports and then just either give or sell the photo to the paper. No longer paperS:-)

So true...but we are talking about the 'masses' here.... For me, true....just leave the phone someplace in a corner (egads; like the old land 'mines' phones).... I find it exhilarating to leave the phone. FREEDOM......

The X100V isn't a compact camera, so I can see where it would be as slow as a phone.

And having owed both an X100V and X-Pro3, neither is as fast as a GR from power-on to taking a picture.

If the camera is ready to go by the time it reaches my eye, is the actual start-up time relevant in most cases?

For new, certainly.
For used, certainly not.

If you don’t need to be ready to shoot quickly, then no.

But my point is, with the GR I never bring the camera to my eye, and on the street sometimes shit happens and fast matters.

And that's why a phone won't replace my camera.

Not sure you have really dispelled any myths. What you have basically said is "I have a better phone than you" and "you're never worried about the consequences of dropping it".

My wife is a big iPhone fan. Both her and my daughter use iPhones. Both have smashed the screens twice and also smashed the ipad. The problem was that they had those silly transparent cases that wrap around the edges and provide zero protection for the screen. I have never damaged a phone because I use those wallet style cases, despite the fact I'm clumsy and typically drop it several times a day.

I think those clip on grips with bluetooth shutter releases are pretty good. When I fit mine on to the phone it transforms the handling. Unfortunately, it is incompatible with the protective case which has to be completely removed. Not only is this endless fiddly, but it quickly wears out the case. So I don't bother.

I'm very fussy about the ergonomics of my cameras. I have changed cameras a number of times to escape irritations with handling. I'm prepared to give the phone more of a pass because it is designed to be a, er, phone not a camera. Any camera is better than no camera, but I've no intention of using my phone instead of a camera, it's very poorly designed for taking pictures. No complaints about image quality though.

Sometimes. If that is of great importance to you, and you genuinely find the phone is too slow, then you've chosen well. I don't find the phone's startup time to be an issue — my own reaction time is more likely to cost me a split-second shot. If I'm out shooting street, the camera I'm using is in a ready state, not sitting in a pocket.

I gave serious consideration to a GR myself. I decided it didn’t do $1000 more than my iPhone for me, or my photography, plus it would become another thing to carry and curate. It's great that there are solutions for both of us.

Just to be clear, I have considered that I just may have a shitty old phone...
And yes, $1000 isn't cheap by any stretch.

Isn't that about what an iphone costs?

I've used my wife's iphone plenty of times, she swears by it and laughs at my Moto G30, but I can't see any practical difference between them that explains the enormous price differential. Her phone cost a £1000, my camera cost £130, roughly the same as my phone...

Yep...