• Members 30 posts
    May 10, 2023, 9:15 p.m.

    Hi Sandy,

    Just to add a few points to what Jack said...

    If you are referring to Jack's setup (which he posted pictures of above), it's a bit of a novel setup in that he is using one camera to take individual long exposures, and another to simultaneously record footage. Normally most people would do one or the other, but Jack had the good idea of doing both since it helps with locating events (meteors) within the footage, which is time consuming to go through in the search for events of interest. Doing it this way, it's faster to check the images, and use that to work out roughly where/when to find the event in the footage, but there's no need to do it this way.

    With regards to telescopes vs camera lenses, for meteors (and other types of wide field astrophotography eg. Auroras) camera lens are preferred over telescopes, which tend to have quite narrow fields of view. For meteors, a wider field of view covers more atmosphere, so there is a higher chance of catching them. For many applications telescopes and lenses are interchangeable, and can give similar results, although this is not always the case, so you need to do your homework when choosing. Each has advantages and disadvantages.

    If you are asking how best to capture a background of many stars, then there are many factors which will determine how starry your background is. Probably the most important is having a good (not too light polluted) clear sky. If you have access to dark rural skies you'll get better results, and have less work to do to correct images/remove light pollution, although you can still get good results from suburban/light polluted sites if you know what you are doing as Jack has shown.

    Camera and lens become more important if you are under less light polluted skies, and/or want to image faint meteors. If you want many stars in an image then either dark skies + fast lens or dark skies + tracker is probably the best way to go.

    For imaging meteors we tend to forego the very starry backgrounds, and concentrate on catching meteors instead, but both are possible from darker skies. In my own case, I started recording footage partly because it's more forgiving with more light the polluted skies we moved to a few years back. Before that (living in a low Bortle 4 area, ie fairly dark) I would mainly shoot long exposures. Long exposures here suffer badly from light pollution, especially low down in the sky. With footage I'm using 1/30 s exposure time, which does not give light pollution the time to build up in a long exposure, while at the same time being able to use a very sensitive camera+lens combination.

    Here (and also Part #2) for example is footage from our old house (taken last year during the Perseid meteor shower) where I was able to use very high ISO once it was fully dark (revealing more stars). Compare that with this footage of a fireball from here under relatively good conditions (aside from the light pollution). Both examples are using same camera+lens.

  • Members 30 posts
    May 10, 2023, 9:43 p.m.

    Jack,

    I'd like to draw your attention to this thread on CN forums. There's a bit of a mystery, and I was about to post a further reply (will do after this), but would be interested to hear your perspective too.

  • Members 37 posts
    May 11, 2023, 2:59 a.m.

    Good topic, and I posted a reply therein. I’m pretty sure he captured smoke trails left over from a meteor. I have seen some images of meteors taken at telephoto FL which were rotating through the path much like a bullet fired through a rifled firearm will, but those look much different and the path is straight. His smoke trails looked like the winds had blown them around quite a bit.

  • Members 30 posts
    May 11, 2023, 3:28 a.m.

    I read your reply Jack, and fully agree, except for the use of the term "burning". We are at altitudes here were although oxygen is the predominant atmospheric gas, the air is much too thin to support combustion. As far as I'm aware, even at the peak of Everest the air is too thin for combustion, and it must be orders of magnitude thinner up there I would guess. So instead of burning, "ionization" is the term I'd use. The process is similar in auroras, hence we have the "auraural green line" of oxygen @ 557.7 nm. That is my understanding at least.

    Completely with you regarding the "rifling" with telephoto meteors - the exchanges we had on DPR with Roger spring to mind!

  • Members 37 posts
    May 11, 2023, 6:13 p.m.

    Leo, I took your advice and have been learning DaVinci Resolve 18.5. Great editor! Here is a revised video of my meteor which I think looks a lot better than the one created in iMovie.

    April Lyrids meteor

  • Members 30 posts
    May 11, 2023, 7:04 p.m.

    Good to hear you are getting on well with Resolve Jack. It has a well designed work-flow that is quite intuitive, so quite easy to edit a basic clip.

    There does seem to be quite a bit of posterization going on there though. I always got some when working on timelapses which I could not figure out/get rid of, but videos have been fine.

    Which output settings are you using? I set mine as: Vimeo 2160p, Qicktime, and crucially MPEG. Nothing else seems to work well for me.

  • Members 37 posts
    May 12, 2023, 5:26 p.m.

    I set the Delivery settings to MP4, H.264, 3840 x 2160 Ultra HD, 23.976 fps, and everything else is set to Auto or whatever DR18.5 has it set to. I looked at some Youtube video on the best settings for posting video to Youtube and that seemed to be the general consensus. I probably need to see about getting a paid Vimeo subscription. Youtube is really not that good. I think I had a Vimeo free account years ago, so I'll have to check and see if it is still active. My camera settings were 24p 60M and the ISO was 32,000. I don't remember what Picture Profile I used on the camera for shooting the video. My ZV-E10 is just an APS-C camera and doesn't in anyway compare to an a7S model, so I'm really pushing it to the limit, especially since I'm shooting in Bortle 8 skies.

    I'm not exactly sure what you mean by posterization, but I do think I went overboard adjusting the Curves to make the stars pop out better. I need to tone that back down and focus more on the meteor because making the stars pop made the meteor become too bright and lost some detail. If we ever get some clear sky again, I would like to shoot using PP7 which is S-Log2. I think I'm confident enough in using DR18.5 to post process it. S-Log2 should make HDR possible. S-Log3 doesn't really work well with 8-bit cameras, and the ZV-E10 is just 8-bit.

    At least I'm having fun learning the ropes for shooting video. Now if the darn clouds will go away I’ll be happy!

  • Members 37 posts
    May 12, 2023, 5:59 p.m.
  • Members 30 posts
    May 12, 2023, 8:01 p.m.

    I took a screenshot during the fade, which is when it seemed to stand out most, and used curves to make the posterization stand out more. It's the concentric rings made out of large blocks.
    lyrid-1.jpg
    As I understand it, it's caused by there not being enough bits and therefore smooth graduations in tone, so the differences in tone caused by vignetting are made more obvious than if there were a smooth transition between different tones. Not sure what causes it, but you must be clipping the blacks somehow I think - possibly with curves, but perhaps it may be the output from your camera.

    I thought that may be the problem, but fairly sure the a7sII is also 8-bit, and I'm not seeing a problem. I'm thinking that curves might be the problem.

    It sounds like you are taking to it like a duck to water. Going from stills to footage did feel like a natural progression to me. We are actually getting some mostly clear nights here now, and looking like at least a couple more to come in the next week, so I can't complain too much. Caught this event last night - fairly close, but nothing special in terms of brightness, although there were a few small flares along it's path. I'll try and post a clip somewhere at some point.

    lyrid-1.jpg

    JPG, 58.9 KB, uploaded by 1DSmII on May 12, 2023.

  • Members 30 posts
    May 14, 2023, 6:07 p.m.

    If you're only uploading the occasional small clip, it's probably not worth it. I do prefer Vimeo, but half regretting subscribing now. If you do decide to go for a paid subscription, wait till they send you an offer (make sure your account is active). I think I got 15% off.